Hi All,
First post following first reasonably unsuccessful attempt to go out for the first time on my newly acquired 26x. (engine start problems, not what this question is about but if anyone has any top tips why the Yamaha F50 cranks strongly but doesn't fire up they are very welcome. It started up first try when I collected it but has been sat for a couple of months now. Planning to check the spark plugs and try again)
The question is about the winch strap attachment hard point at the bow. I decided to go out on the river for the first time to get to know the boat etc. Had a good slip way to use, if slightly steep (Benson on the Thames). When I couldn't get the engine started I had to take it back out, as mentioned a good slip way so I was able to get the trailer well in and pull boat on to the trailer. I couldn't pull it the last 3 inches to the bow rest so I used the winch to help and moved it easily enough all the way forward. I locked off the winch and started to tow it slowly out. As the boat was coming fully out of the water I heard some creaking from the winch area and then a bang as the winch strap snapped. After some initial worry I saw that the boat had simply moved back 3 inches on the trailer and seemed quite stable. I examined the winch strap and it had simply snapped, it was quite old, a little frayed in places with the odd stain mark but not terrible. My concern was the attachment point. When I checked that, the hull seemed fine but the upper nut was slightly loose and could be tightened by hand, slightly worried it may have moved under the strain but also it could have been like that already as I didn't check and the hull looked fine. The sealant around seems sound but gives a little if you use a bit of force, however it looks a bit old and should probably be replaced anyway.
So my questions:
Is it likely that the bow hard point was shifted/damaged by this?
was I doing something fundamentally wrong in towing it out like that with strain on the winch strap? (as mentioned slipway was a bit steep but nothing ridiculous), I didn't expect the winch strap to be taking that much force, more just holding it in place.
How can I inspect the bow hardpoint to check its ok?
Hopefully it's just that the winch strap was too old and weak but any thoughts welcome.
Sorry for such a long description.
Best Regards,
Warren
Not experienced so wait for the old hands but had similar with my M in that it did not want to come up the last few inches. .. I had replaced my strap as a precaution but was not happy with the force put through it try to get the final few inches.
I had read about the 'Mac Bump' which basically involves doing 5 ish mph and hitting the brakes to slide the boat the last bit. Anyway did this and all good.
I would not worry too much about any damage unless it appears cracked but equally would be wary of loading that D.
Btw I would never rely on just the winch to hold boat to trailer. I always have a secondary line attached to deck cleats.
Yes Matthew you are correct about not relying on winch alone especially on a steepish slip. Safest to attach a second line especially since in some x trailers the bow can tip up. I would ezpe t the D on the boat to be really robust and am surprised there is any play Warren. I would have thought it needs an eye kept on it and may be me essay to explore the floatation cavity at the bow where the bolts go through to.
Regarding nonstarting engine it sounds like fuel is not getting through. Check the fuel line is fitted with the arrows on bulb in direction of of flow....I've done that ...Otherwise check the bulb is soft and pumps the fuel . You can use end of pencil to pres the ball valve at engine end to check fuel getting through and that also is a way of getting rid of a fuel lock. Lastly the bulb can get locked up by stuck ball valves after not being used. Winding the pipe backwards with a stick can shift it. Finally there could be a problem at the tank connection.....I've had ALL of these problems over the years !
Roly
Hi Warren
The winch strops do take a lot of strain, and it's not uncommon for them to fail when old. In my experience the D ring is very solidly anchored to a very strong part of the hull. It's designed that way, as MacGregor knew how much stress was likely to be put on it!
I tie a safety line as a backup to the strop, but still using the D ring. A length of 10mm line should be strong enough.
The nuts on the outside are merely lock nuts to prevent the D working loose, they don't take any load. So if they're slack, just tighten them down against the hull.
It's best not to pull the winch strop too tight when hauling out. If you think about the angles of the boat and trailer, as you haul out, the boat tips back onto the trailer. This pulls the top of the bow away from the V and the winch. You actually have the leverage of the boat rotating around the fore bunk, which applies a force greater than the weight of the boat to the strop! After getting the boat as far forward onto the trailer as you can while afloat, slacken the winch a bit, then rely on the Mac-bump when on the level to move the boat snugly forward on the trailer.
Rick Jones (Treasurer), former 26X & 19 owner, Isle of Wight
Interesting problem, Roly is right about various starting problems, stale fuel , poor bulb due to hardening, but I had a rare fault with tank itself- the valve in the tank breaks down and won't pump fuel . Also it's very difficult to always get the boat fully forward on the ramp, and the 'shunt' usually works - but not on gravel.
Straps are cheap and easily available.
On the direction of fuel line, first time out with unproven engine and it started to cough and splutter.
Bulb was sucked in and after a brief 'oh sh1t' moment I diagnosed that some idiot (me) had the fuel line wrong way around.... but oddly I had no problem starting and it ran for a good 10 mins like that.
Injection engines hold a substantial amount of fuel in the injection pump and associated plumbing. Enough to idle for 10 mins is quite common. Can be quite disconcerting if you're running the engine to drain it of fuel for over-wintering, with the tank disconnected!
The most frequent cause of delayed fuel starvation is forgetting to open the vent in the tank - done that a few times!
Rick Jones (Treasurer), former 26X & 19 owner, Isle of Wight
From experience...did you fasten the safety cord before trying to start the motor?
David Claassen
"Logan's Run"
2006 26M
To start Yamaha 50:
- battery switch on
- lower the propeller
- prime the fuel line
- engage kill switch cord
- check that gearbox is in NEUTRAL
- turn the ignition key
Ask me how I learned the above. Yes, the hard way! I'm novice to sailing /motoring, so please forgive me if I post obvious things. After few hours of sailing I needed to motor but the motor would not start! The wind was generous and the rocks downwind very close. Call to a friend thankfully saved the day - going through the above sequence revealed that gear lever was just off neutral, must have shifted accidentally or never brought back to neutral when the ignition key switched off.
Yamaha won't start if gearbox not in neutral.
Hi,
Thank you all for very quick and detailed responses, much appreciated.
I was able to remove an inspection plate and checkout the inside mounting of the D-ring and all looks fine, so pretty happy that it is ok. (Not sure if the inspection plate is standard as it looked like a home mod by a previous owner, I've attached a picture).
Thank you for all the info on the strap. I had been using a second line to the bow cleat for towing, I just hadn't put it on to take it up the slipway - I will in future! Rick, thanks for the thoughts about angles and leverage, I'll monitor the strain on the strap more closely.
Thanks for the thoughts on the engine. When trying to start on Saturday I had forgotten to connect the kill cord for the first few tries (Dull!) but then realised. Everything else was OK I think. It was a new fuel line and bulb, attached in right direction and fuel was coming through the line. Battery on 'All', prop lowered, kill switch in (eventually!), fuel air vent open, throttle flat in start position (also tried a bit of throttle at times), in neutral, turn key. Engine turned and turned strongly but not even hint of ignition apart from a couple of times when it gave the slightest of split second coughs just before the starter cut out. So a bit confusing as started straight away when I was checking it out when buying. Which was impressive as it had been sat in a dry barn for quite a while. It's been out side for a couple of months since then with engine vertical, it's had a tarp over the engine so surprised if moisture has got in somewhere but possible. Any recommendations of mechanics around Salisbury/Southampton area? Ideally one that would come out, a precautionary service may be worthwhile, although the engine is immaculate and clearly been very well looked after.
Thanks again for all the help, really appreciated.
Warren
D-ring inner bracket
Sorry to hear about engine problems still. I use MB marine based at Ocean Quay in Southampton. They will come out but not sure how far. Very knowledgeable about Yamaha.
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