Would anyone who has been contributing to this discussion like to take a couple of photos of your various set-ups and perhaps a short description to put in the magazine???
And send them to me.
For the benefit of members who don't read these forums??? (fora??)
Haha, Dave, thank you, I was thinking just that but was a little concerned about what my mooring chappy would think. I imagine he already has me pegged as an AR:) . I'll do as you suggest.
Good idea Liz. There are so many variables, there must be infinite sets of circumstances, you almost need some super algorithm into which one could input one's predicament. I guess that's called a forum.
—
MacGregor 26M 2009 - Sky's the Limit - Suzuki DF50
I am a Newbie Macgreggor owner, I am currently on a swinging mooring (tidal) not fresh water and noticed that Mac's like to dance around a fair bit. I was concerned about Rope Chafe through the fairlead so i found this neat invention http://www.spiroll.com/, doubled up on two ropes and chains , i also bought a cheap GPS tracker and geofenced it to the boat, so if the worst happens i know about it straight away by txt message.
12mm chain will take a 10t boat, 8mm should be plenty for a Mac.
On the basis that most ground tackle is galvanised, stick to galvanised chain and shackles and avoid stainless. Cable ties are destroyed by UV and chafe. Mouse shackles using mousing wire, not cable ties. On my steel gaffer, I use all galvanised shackles which I grease before use and do them up as tight as I can using a large adjustable. None have ever come loose.
I would suggest that the key to a light boat like a mac is to get the bridles about 1/3 of boatlength back from the front. This will stop a lot of the swinging. Have the main chain connection on the roller/front but slack, then have anchor rope (stretchy) to some points well back from the bow taking all the load under normal circumstances. If these chafe through, the boat is still held up front.
Given that my last comment was very sensible and unprovocative, can I ask the question why you keep Macs on a mooring?
I had great fun for 5 years with my 26X and it kept my sons happy during that time. A Mac is a dreadful sailboat and not that good as a speed boat. The only reasons to have a Mac, for me at least, is a) that it is sort of both and b) it is trailerable and a good size inside (with no mooring fees).
One year at Dartmouth Regatta it was quite windy and we had to gybe on the windward leg as tacking was not possible much to the confusion of the others in the fleet.
The second point is the key - one can sail one month in Cornwall and the next in France. With normal holiday restraints that is difficult to achieve with a non-trailerable boat.
That gets me back to the start point. On a mooring, all the advantages are gone.
Haha, thanks Chris, my original plan was to keep the Mac on my driveway and use the free public slipway at Mylor Yacht Harbour. As you say, a cheap and flexible option.
However, when we saw the Mac on its trailer, we realised it would totally dominate the house.
The next idea was to use secure storage and the same free slipway - £360 pa + cost of storing trailer whilst sailing. Not bad and still flexible.
However, as with plan A, there is quite a lot involved in just getting a quick sail and it was felt this would become tedious.
Plan C involved a mooring with hard standing, a slipway and tender park plus car parking all within a stone's throw of each other and 20 mins from home. Cost is £850 pa but is very convenient.
A prime consideration has been that the whole family is happy with the arrangement so this is what we've decided on.
We still have the flexibility to trail if we want but we also have the convenience of a mooring etc.
Of course I agree it's more expensive but one saves a lot owning a Mac as opposed to other boats and I am happy to use a little of that saving to buy some convenience.
You mentioned that the Mac is a dreadful sail boat. Well I've listened to a lot of arguments on the issue so I'm looking forward to finding out for myself how she behaves. I will try to be sensible.
But first I have to pass my Day Skipper. Sunday suddenly seems very close:)
—
MacGregor 26M 2009 - Sky's the Limit - Suzuki DF50
Chris, you also mentioned bridle mooring. I have heard of this but confess to not understanding it as I've been rather preoccupied.
Could anyone please explain in simple terms exactly how this system operates and how it would be implemented on the Mac.
I do still have a little leeway as I'm not handing over my junk for installation for a day or two so I could possibly opt for a bridle, especially this might reduce the swinging. I imagine this could be important on a drying mooring.
—
MacGregor 26M 2009 - Sky's the Limit - Suzuki DF50
The ratings for chain depend on the coil steel grade it's made from and the welding so a lot depends on the quality of chain you buy. Be warned some cheap manufacturers lie by just copying standard ratings tables and when you come to test it it is nowhere near as good. I have destruction tested for lifting applications and had to send a lot of chain back for being substandard.
I would be cautious of specifying a smaller chain, small defects and fractured welds may go unnoticed until the chain parts but an oversized chain will still have plenty of strength even when it looks so old and corroded that you want to replace it.
A Mac is not heavy but the normal practice is to oversize the chain to give a good long life. It also depends how much of the year you intend to leave it out there. I've seen 6mm and 8mm chain that was good enough on paper but after one or two seasons needed to be scrapped. It is highly dependent on the peak load caused by the snatching action and that depends on how exposed the site is. An oversized chain has ample strength and is simply corrosion limited. There is also the matter of the quality of the galv but that is very hard to judge without doing tests.
I agree, steer clear of stainless chain for continuous exposure to salt corrosion. Welded stainless can suffer invisible crevice corrosion and stainless is more brittle to start (and more expensive).
Bridles simply divide the attachment of the mooring into two and make fast at two points, say either side of the fordeck or even near the shroud chainplates. When the boat attempts to swing one side goes taut and the pull resists the swing and tends to pull the boat straight.
We then come back to my biggest concern with mooring a Mac and that is finding suitably strong deck fittings to withstand the horizontal loads.
I might be being pessimistic. Has anyone had the original deck cleats fail?
Would anyone who has been contributing to this discussion like to take a couple of photos of your various set-ups and perhaps a short description to put in the magazine???
And send them to me.
For the benefit of members who don't read these forums??? (fora??)
Thanks
Liz
Haha, Dave, thank you, I was thinking just that but was a little concerned about what my mooring chappy would think. I imagine he already has me pegged as an AR:) . I'll do as you suggest.
Good idea Liz. There are so many variables, there must be infinite sets of circumstances, you almost need some super algorithm into which one could input one's predicament. I guess that's called a forum.
MacGregor 26M 2009 - Sky's the Limit - Suzuki DF50
Hi Mike
I am a Newbie Macgreggor owner, I am currently on a swinging mooring (tidal) not fresh water and noticed that Mac's like to dance around a fair bit. I was concerned about Rope Chafe through the fairlead so i found this neat invention http://www.spiroll.com/, doubled up on two ropes and chains , i also bought a cheap GPS tracker and geofenced it to the boat, so if the worst happens i know about it straight away by txt message.
Mark.
If anyone feels moved to prepare something in the next week, say, that would be good for issue 94!!
Hello everyone. Long time inactive I am afraid.
Some comments which may be helpful:
12mm chain will take a 10t boat, 8mm should be plenty for a Mac.
On the basis that most ground tackle is galvanised, stick to galvanised chain and shackles and avoid stainless. Cable ties are destroyed by UV and chafe. Mouse shackles using mousing wire, not cable ties. On my steel gaffer, I use all galvanised shackles which I grease before use and do them up as tight as I can using a large adjustable. None have ever come loose.
I would suggest that the key to a light boat like a mac is to get the bridles about 1/3 of boatlength back from the front. This will stop a lot of the swinging. Have the main chain connection on the roller/front but slack, then have anchor rope (stretchy) to some points well back from the bow taking all the load under normal circumstances. If these chafe through, the boat is still held up front.
Happy sailing and fair winds to you all.
Kind regards
Chris Harnan
Given that my last comment was very sensible and unprovocative, can I ask the question why you keep Macs on a mooring?
I had great fun for 5 years with my 26X and it kept my sons happy during that time. A Mac is a dreadful sailboat and not that good as a speed boat. The only reasons to have a Mac, for me at least, is a) that it is sort of both and b) it is trailerable and a good size inside (with no mooring fees).
One year at Dartmouth Regatta it was quite windy and we had to gybe on the windward leg as tacking was not possible much to the confusion of the others in the fleet.
The second point is the key - one can sail one month in Cornwall and the next in France. With normal holiday restraints that is difficult to achieve with a non-trailerable boat.
That gets me back to the start point. On a mooring, all the advantages are gone.
Chris
Haha, thanks Chris, my original plan was to keep the Mac on my driveway and use the free public slipway at Mylor Yacht Harbour. As you say, a cheap and flexible option.
However, when we saw the Mac on its trailer, we realised it would totally dominate the house.
The next idea was to use secure storage and the same free slipway - £360 pa + cost of storing trailer whilst sailing. Not bad and still flexible.
However, as with plan A, there is quite a lot involved in just getting a quick sail and it was felt this would become tedious.
Plan C involved a mooring with hard standing, a slipway and tender park plus car parking all within a stone's throw of each other and 20 mins from home. Cost is £850 pa but is very convenient.
A prime consideration has been that the whole family is happy with the arrangement so this is what we've decided on.
We still have the flexibility to trail if we want but we also have the convenience of a mooring etc.
Of course I agree it's more expensive but one saves a lot owning a Mac as opposed to other boats and I am happy to use a little of that saving to buy some convenience.
You mentioned that the Mac is a dreadful sail boat. Well I've listened to a lot of arguments on the issue so I'm looking forward to finding out for myself how she behaves. I will try to be sensible.
But first I have to pass my Day Skipper. Sunday suddenly seems very close:)
MacGregor 26M 2009 - Sky's the Limit - Suzuki DF50
Chris, you also mentioned bridle mooring. I have heard of this but confess to not understanding it as I've been rather preoccupied.
Could anyone please explain in simple terms exactly how this system operates and how it would be implemented on the Mac.
I do still have a little leeway as I'm not handing over my junk for installation for a day or two so I could possibly opt for a bridle, especially this might reduce the swinging. I imagine this could be important on a drying mooring.
MacGregor 26M 2009 - Sky's the Limit - Suzuki DF50
The ratings for chain depend on the coil steel grade it's made from and the welding so a lot depends on the quality of chain you buy. Be warned some cheap manufacturers lie by just copying standard ratings tables and when you come to test it it is nowhere near as good. I have destruction tested for lifting applications and had to send a lot of chain back for being substandard.
I would be cautious of specifying a smaller chain, small defects and fractured welds may go unnoticed until the chain parts but an oversized chain will still have plenty of strength even when it looks so old and corroded that you want to replace it.
A Mac is not heavy but the normal practice is to oversize the chain to give a good long life. It also depends how much of the year you intend to leave it out there. I've seen 6mm and 8mm chain that was good enough on paper but after one or two seasons needed to be scrapped. It is highly dependent on the peak load caused by the snatching action and that depends on how exposed the site is. An oversized chain has ample strength and is simply corrosion limited. There is also the matter of the quality of the galv but that is very hard to judge without doing tests.
I agree, steer clear of stainless chain for continuous exposure to salt corrosion. Welded stainless can suffer invisible crevice corrosion and stainless is more brittle to start (and more expensive).
Dave.
Dave Newton Sailbadthesinner
Bridles simply divide the attachment of the mooring into two and make fast at two points, say either side of the fordeck or even near the shroud chainplates. When the boat attempts to swing one side goes taut and the pull resists the swing and tends to pull the boat straight.
We then come back to my biggest concern with mooring a Mac and that is finding suitably strong deck fittings to withstand the horizontal loads.
I might be being pessimistic. Has anyone had the original deck cleats fail?
Dave.
Dave Newton Sailbadthesinner
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